That school shooting in the States

[Kwacky]

Sadly it's yet another massacre at a school. More kids have been shot in the USA this year than serving American police officers.

What makes this one even more horrific is the age of the victims. It was a primary school FFS.

Then it transpires that one of the teachers was killed trying to protect her class. How to make that worse? How about finding out that the stress of hearing about his wife's sacrifice caused her husband to suffer a fatal heart attack. They've got children of their own.

But it gets even worse. There's videos showing parents trying to get in to the school to help. Police are stopping them. The police aren't going after the shooter, they're physically detaining parents. While kids are getting shot and lie bleeding in their classroom.

The Republican responses? Make schools like prisons with armed guards at the single entry point.

Don't politicise the shooting.

Teach kids and teachers how to deal better with shooters.

Arm teachers

[Jack]

I don't see how arming teachers or having armed guards will stop it , the police were there for some 40 minutes before attempting to put a stop to it .

[Jack]

I am surprised the NRA hasn't suggested arming all the kids .

[StMarks]

It's yet another example of that obsolete, yet still all too widespread and damaging to our species.: the phenomenon of Religion.

Every attempt made to address the problem by politicians in america runs up against their "God given right to bear arms"..

[Perkles]

Prayers got out to all the victims, I honestly cant ever see the mass shootings in the USA being resolved

[D41]

Every aspect of this is tragic. I don't think arming teachers is the answer any more than I think the police should be giving lessons in English Lit.
I know there are school districts where this is allowed, but I don't know anything about the effectiveness of the practice (the guns, not the language classes).
The police are going to keep anyone & everyone - parent or otherwise - as far as they can from an active shooter situation - that's just common sense. You start letting parents run loose into an active shooter situation like that to retrieve Little Johnny and the body count is going to be higher, not lower. I don't think anyone questions parental instinct in this regard, but in an instance like this it would be a hindrance, not a help.

[Kwacky]

The issue isn't that the police stopped the parents, it's that the police were there to stop the parents and nut engage the shooter

A couple of police officers have admitted that they went in to collect their own kids.

[D41]

To be fair, a cop carries a 9mm pistol or similar, plus a backup - typically something of a smaller caliber and also lighter in pure portability terms. The shooter was armed with an assault rifle.
Pistols against an assault rifle is a no-go scenario....more so when there's hostages involved.
My understanding is that a US Border Patrol HRT unit was in the area, and was brought in to do the takedown....a field in which they specialize.

[Cav]

If the root cause is psychotic individuals getting their hands on guns and the symptom is school children being shot, at the very least you tackle the symptoms while you work on a plan for attacking the root cause.

By this I mean, security fencing and 1 (probably 2 for fire regs) entrances to the school which is monitored by security - as a minimum.

The root cause thing is tricky though, not many countries in the world have an ongoing school shooting "epidemic". This whole "god-given right to hold weapons" is complete bullshit though, men in charge gave the right and could take it away. America is a messed up place.

[duke63]

To be fair, a cop carries a 9mm pistol or similar, plus a backup - typically something of a smaller caliber and also lighter in pure portability terms. The shooter was armed with an assault rifle.
Pistols against an assault rifle is a no-go scenario....more so when there's hostages involved.
My understanding is that a US Border Patrol HRT unit was in the area, and was brought in to do the takedown....a field in which they specialize.

Which is all the more reason that the general public should not be able to own semi automatic assault rifles.

What sort of a **** up Nation arms the upholders of law and order with a lesser weapon than everyone else can own??

[D41]

I dunno.... maybe the same sort of nation that arms it's police with truncheons to tackle armed robbers with sawn-off shotguns....??

[Kwacky]

We really don't have a problem in this country with police officers getting shot.

Does anyone want their kids going to school in what is effectively a prison?

Some of those police officers may only have had a 9mm pistol but they felt safe enough to go in and get their own children our.

They'll be blaming video games and rap music next.

[Jack]

Police on the scene were armed with long rifles and shotguns , I have seen these weapons on video , in my estimation they were more than well enough armed to do their jobs. As for "God given rights" from a document written by men which includes an article about the separation of Church and State ? I believe that there is an easy fix that still conforms to the Constitution - if you want to own a firearm you must be a fully vetted member of the "well regulated militia " .Fully vetted could include such things as a full background check , regular drug tests and a minimum age of 25 , the Federal government could also impose ridiculous amounts of tax on weapons/ammo and make the acquisition of a permit difficult and very very expensive all without infringing on anyone's rights . Or they could do the sensible thing and ban domestic ownership of all firearms , **** what some guys said and thought over 200 years ago , the world and society have moved on since then as have firearms , I doubt you could pull off a mass shooting with a muzzle loading musket .

[D41]

Does anyone want their kids going to school in what is effectively a prison?

I can see why some might look at it that way, or it could perhaps be considered as something more akin to a bank.... which also has a really high level of security, and is there to protect something that has great value.

[Kwacky]

A bank is a building, not a compound.

Are you really comparing school children to cash?

[D41]

No, I'm comparing levels of security.

[StMarks]

Police on the scene were armed with long rifles and shotguns , I have seen these weapons on video , in my estimation they were more than well enough armed to do their jobs. As for "God given rights" from a document written by men which includes an article about the separation of Church and State ? I believe that there is an easy fix that still conforms to the Constitution - if you want to own a firearm you must be a fully vetted member of the "well regulated militia " .Fully vetted could include such things as a full background check , regular drug tests and a minimum age of 25 , the Federal government could also impose ridiculous amounts of tax on weapons/ammo and make the acquisition of a permit difficult and very very expensive all without infringing on anyone's rights . Or they could do the sensible thing and ban domestic ownership of all firearms , **** what some guys said and thought over 200 years ago , the world and society have moved on since then as have firearms , I doubt you could pull off a mass shooting with a muzzle loading musket .

^ That, precisely.!

[Cav]

Are you really comparing school children to cash?

Schools do that for you

[D41]

Lolz!

[Monty]

If only they had concrete evidence or at the very least previous precedence where changes to gun law had had a significant impact.

https://injuryprevention.bmj.com/content/12/6/365" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

What's utterly tragic is they all know this, it's a choice.