What a shit awful country we have become

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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Jack » 20 May 2018, 11:35

Kwacky wrote:Yet we can afford vanity projects like trident and HS2 and find the money to bomb foreign countries


While public services are pared to the bone and beyond .
Credit is indeed a wonderful thing until it comes to paying it back , we currently spend more on interest than we do on the Police and the NHS combined we will only start to see the true effects of this amount of debt when we have difficulty meeting the interest payments .
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby D41 » 20 May 2018, 11:50

duke63 wrote:
Monty wrote:The power of the Daily Mail knows no bounds


It frightens me to think how easily British people have become brainwashed by the right wing press and politicians.

The day the country eventually runs out of cash, then people might realise just how much they have been conned.


You don't think the left-wingers are equally susceptible??

Left or Right...you pay your money & you make your choice....neither of them are wrong per se. Individual choices, that's all
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby duke63 » 20 May 2018, 13:11

Rossgo wrote:
duke63 wrote:
Rossgo wrote:Surely they pay huge payments for 1st class travel, they pay huge amounts for the best food in the city, they pay huge amounts for the best cars/ bikes in the world, they pay millions for a property, they pay a silly amount for everything which has taxes on it. They cant escape that surely. If they spend they pay taxes surely?

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Thta's OK then, Being wealthy means you have no obligation to pay tax in the same way as the ordinary minions.
We are talking about a very small percentage here. They will pay more taxes in one purchase than an entire year of us paying taxes! However on the flip side i have a massive problem with people buying holiday homes here and only being used for small amounts of time

What i am more pissed off about are these people who dont go and work and alloe us to pay for their lives or only work a small anount of time and if they work extra they moan because their benefits get cut. That really grinds my gears.

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I bet the Country loses more in tax from offshore tax avoidance than it does from people out of work. You are being duped, Rossgo.
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Rossgo » 20 May 2018, 13:55

duke63 wrote:
Rossgo wrote:
duke63 wrote:[quote="Rossgo"]Surely they pay huge payments for 1st class travel, they pay huge amounts for the best food in the city, they pay huge amounts for the best cars/ bikes in the world, they pay millions for a property, they pay a silly amount for everything which has taxes on it. They cant escape that surely. If they spend they pay taxes surely?

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Thta's OK then, Being wealthy means you have no obligation to pay tax in the same way as the ordinary minions.
We are talking about a very small percentage here. They will pay more taxes in one purchase than an entire year of us paying taxes! However on the flip side i have a massive problem with people buying holiday homes here and only being used for small amounts of time

What i am more pissed off about are these people who dont go and work and alloe us to pay for their lives or only work a small anount of time and if they work extra they moan because their benefits get cut. That really grinds my gears.

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I bet the Country loses more in tax from offshore tax avoidance than it does from people out of work. You are being duped, Rossgo.[/quote]You are prob right i have no figures to disprove you Duke.

They know the system i guess, like many things we all cut corners i guess for them its just on a bigger scale than what we can possibly do. But then again maybe we should all pay tax regardless of what you earn? All contribute to the system, as it were, no-one is exempt, fairer isnt it?

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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Kwacky » 20 May 2018, 17:48

HMRC estimates that illegal tax evasion and legal tax avoidance together cost the government about £34 billion a year

To put that in perspective:

For 2015/16, the overall NHS budget was around £116.4 billion.
Uk Defence spending is budgeted to be £47.2 billion
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Rossgo » 21 May 2018, 07:08

Nice to get the figures. Not too surprised it would be that figure when you compare to what they earn prob a year, inside their billions too i would guess

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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Cav » 21 May 2018, 07:10

Don't they estimate the cost of 'fixing' the tax evasion to be more than triple the money lost though? I thought I saw these figures from Corbyn back at the General Election
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Kwacky » 21 May 2018, 08:47

It's a couple of changes to the law. It wouldn't cost much.

Enforcing it is the main problem.
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Cav » 21 May 2018, 09:08

By fixing I mean all acts encompassed within this issue.. so the cost of the law changes and the enforcement. I believe Corbyn published the cost required to do that and projected the long term gain to the nation.

All the tories seem to worry about is right now. Okay, the estimated deficit this year is down to £1.9bn and I agree, that is good, however, with the selling of assets and no solid plan on skilled labour etc for the country, where is the economy heading in the next 10 years
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Kwacky » 21 May 2018, 09:21

Is that billion or Trillion?

http://www.nationaldebtclock.co.uk/

General government gross debt was £1,786.3 billion at the end of December 2017, equivalent to 87.7% of gross domestic product (GDP), 27.7 percentage points above the reference value of 60% set out in the Protocol on the Excessive Deficit Procedure.

General government gross debt first exceeded the 60% Maastricht reference value at the end of 2009, when it was 64.1% of GDP.

General government deficit (or net borrowing) was £39.4 billion in 2017, a decrease of £19.0 billion compared with 2016; this is equivalent to 1.9% of GDP, 1.1 percentage points below the reference value of 3.0% set out in the Protocol on the Excessive Deficit Procedure.
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby duke63 » 21 May 2018, 09:21

They have no idea how much money they are losing out on as they have no idea of the scale of the problem as offshore companies do not have to provide accounts to anyone.

Its easy enough to change the law to ensure that tax on assets and income based in this country, is taxed in this country rather than in an offshore haven.
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Cav » 21 May 2018, 09:27

Billion. The website looked a lot more legit than that countdown one and the numbers you're quoting are vastly different to where I was looking.

Feck knows what's really going on, I doubt they do
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Kwacky » 21 May 2018, 09:40

This country owes close to £2 trillion pounds. Google will give a large number of websites showing the figures.

I got some of those figures from the government's own website

https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governme ... tember2017

You can see how the debt has risen on this graph

https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governme ... /hf6w/pusf
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Cav » 21 May 2018, 09:58

I know debt has risen but deficit has fallen. I realise my mistake in the figure I quoted.. it was 1.9% GDP, not £1.9bn.

I think it's good that the deficit is falling, it should result in debt falling once the deficit has plateaued too. My worry is the manner in which they are achieving this deficit reduction
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Kwacky » 21 May 2018, 10:04

But sadly it changes month by month.
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Jack » 21 May 2018, 10:22

Does that £2 Trillion include the unfunded liabilities ?
I believe the true figure is much higher , it stood at £8.6 Trillion at the end of 2014 - 2015 , over £300,000 per household .
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Cav » 21 May 2018, 10:43

Jack wrote:Does that £2 Trillion include the unfunded liabilities ?
I believe the true figure is much higher , it stood at £8.6 Trillion at the end of 2014 - 2015 , over £300,000 per household .

They're quoting £32k per household now. It's fallen bloody quickly if accurate
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby duke63 » 21 May 2018, 10:56

The idea of quoting the deficit figure rather than the true total debt figure was a ploy politicians starting using to hide the reality.

There is nothing no wrong with debt if it’s used to invest for the future. And there will be a return on it.
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Kwacky » 21 May 2018, 11:08

Jack wrote:Does that £2 Trillion include the unfunded liabilities ?
I believe the true figure is much higher , it stood at £8.6 Trillion at the end of 2014 - 2015 , over £300,000 per household .



No. That's excluding it. Factoring in all liabilities including state and public sector pensions, the real national debt is closer to £4.8 trillion, some £78,000 for every person in the UK.

It's £56k per tax payer to clear the debt.

Cav, the figure you've seen is £32k per person.
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Re: What a shit awful country we have become

Postby Rossgo » 21 May 2018, 17:09

**** doing governments job...

Advertisement of government job

Looking for a difficult bunch of people to cater for like the Brits, like the idea of letting everyone get into debt, but never actually getting your money back, love the idea of being hated by people just because they like hating on us, then come and work for 'whatever party' we are looking for a much needed magician.

Ring ring, ring ring

Hi im wanting to apply for your magician job, im amazing at making things disappear and making them reappear in a different location.

Boss

Sorry the job advert should of stated mathematician, wait.....



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