Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

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Kwacky
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Kwacky »

StMarks wrote::?
So what precisely is wrong with Jo Swinson then, you two.?
Monty doesn't like her.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Kwacky »

Monty wrote:
Maybe start with her voting record as that's a matter of public record and not an opinion. When she was a minister in coalition with the Tories she voted with the wip more than ass hats like Gove! She actually out Toried Gove!

She's trying to make everyone believe she's something new, a bright new exciting future. She's not, she's just more of the same which is why the establishment like her.
Nothing I say will make you change your view on this. I've seen it said countless times that the LibDems are Tory Lite. Sadly that view came from the Tories after the coalition and the Tories did an excellent job of destroying the liberals for the next general election. The next government was 100% conservative and you know what they've been like since then.

It was a coalition. What was presented in parliament was presented by the coalition but the liberals were very much the junior partner. They tried to influence and dilute tory policy as much as they could. Part of the coalition deal was support by liberal MPs for the conservative party.

So by all means continue to argue that a vote for the liberals is a vote for the conservative party, because that's what the Tories and pro-Brexit want want - a clear division between the parties who could actually stand a chance of stopping or softening Brexit.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Monty »

Kwacky wrote:
Monty wrote:
Maybe start with her voting record as that's a matter of public record and not an opinion. When she was a minister in coalition with the Tories she voted with the wip more than ass hats like Gove! She actually out Toried Gove!

She's trying to make everyone believe she's something new, a bright new exciting future. She's not, she's just more of the same which is why the establishment like her.
Nothing I say will make you change your view on this. I've seen it said countless times that the LibDems are Tory Lite. Sadly that view came from the Tories after the coalition and the Tories did an excellent job of destroying the liberals for the next general election. The next government was 100% conservative and you know what they've been like since then.

It was a coalition. What was presented in parliament was presented by the coalition but the liberals were very much the junior partner. They tried to influence and dilute tory policy as much as they could. Part of the coalition deal was support by liberal MPs for the conservative party.

So by all means continue to argue that a vote for the liberals is a vote for the conservative party, because that's what the Tories and pro-Brexit want want - a clear division between the parties who could actually stand a chance of stopping or softening Brexit.
You're right, you won't. I don't think they are Tory Lite, I think they are Tories.

A once great party, but sadly the greats like Ashdown and Kennedy are long gone.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by duke63 »

The Libdems as part of the coalition were behind one of the best pieces of policy to implemented in recent times which was to increase the personal allowance way above the rate of inflation. It’s now double what it was ten years ago.

Any Labour Government would have been proud of that piece of legislation.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Monty »

And the 5p plastic bag.

The legacy of former Lib Dem leader Charlie Kennedy was a formidable party to the left of New Labour on many issues. But Clegg brought us austerity for the country and socialism for big business.

Swinson will be happy enough if her party doubles in size while the Tories do a trade deal with Trump. As far as she's concerned it’s good for business, whatever the consequences.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by StMarks »

The one enduring policy of the Lib-Dems is that they intend to implement Proportional Representation if they achieve overall control.
This does not play well to the "two biggest players", which is why it is unlikely to be introduced unless they do.
However it would eliminate the ridiculous situation that we currently have, whereby we are required to "vote tactically" or even simply not bother ( further disenfranchising the electorate from our political system) if the seat simply can't be won by our preferred choice.
This NEEDS changing imho, and they would get my vote for that alone,,,, except that this is a "safe conservative seat" & so they will not win here. (headbang)
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Kwacky »

The lib Dems are responsible for austerity?

Jesus.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Monty »

Jointly responsible, yes.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Kwacky »

Probably responsible for introducing it to all of those other countries who went down the austerity route as well.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Monty »

No, but they fully supported it and voted for it in the UK.

To be honest I don't think New Labour would have done much better with Ed "austerity lite" Millbland.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Monty »

StMarks wrote:The one enduring policy of the Lib-Dems is that they intend to implement Proportional Representation if they achieve overall control.
This does not play well to the "two biggest players", which is why it is unlikely to be introduced unless they do.
However it would eliminate the ridiculous situation that we currently have, whereby we are required to "vote tactically" or even simply not bother ( further disenfranchising the electorate from our political system) if the seat simply can't be won by our preferred choice.
This NEEDS changing imho, and they would get my vote for that alone,,,, except that this is a "safe conservative seat" & so they will not win here. (headbang)
I think we should go down the PR route even if it means we end up with BREXIT Party and UKIP MPs. It's wrong that the millions of people that do vote for the greens, UKIP etc have little or no representation in the house.

Jo on the other hand, not so much.
Screenshot 2019-11-09 at 09.02.59.png
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by duke63 »

Without PR i and many others have no say in what happens in any election unless we vote for the status quo, which in my case is that awful excuse of a politician in Gavin Williamson.

My view is not represented and after how many times we have heard right wing politicians spout on about the will of the people and democracy over the last 3 years, then well..... you know they are pretty much all talking bollocks.

Frankly i will be glad to see the back of it all.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by StMarks »

Monty wrote:.......Jo on the other hand, not so much.....
In fairness, isn't that just someone "interpreting based upon" Monty.?
As when you pointed out that she had "towed the line" with her votes whilst they were playing second fiddle to the tories, it does make for good propaganda but doesn't necessarily give an accurate insight to her own chosen preferences.??
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Monty »

StMarks wrote:
Monty wrote:.......Jo on the other hand, not so much.....
In fairness, isn't that just someone "interpreting based upon" Monty.?
As when you pointed out that she had "towed the line" with her votes whilst they were playing second fiddle to the tories, it does make for good propaganda but doesn't necessarily give an accurate insight to her own chosen preferences.??
No, that's her official voting record, but don't take my word for it look it up.

She and Ed Davy voted with the Tory whip more than Gove.
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by Monty »

https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/11971 ... hire/votes" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Syria, Immigrants and world politics.

Post by D41 »

Hmmmm. Apparently she's a "humanist".

Hmmmmmm.
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