What the duck have I done to my bike?

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What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby DaytonAndy » 23 May 2016, 11:18

As you may know I dropped my bike at Oulton recently and it wouldn't start afterwards. Initially the symptoms were of a dead battery. When the starter button was pressed the engine would turn over once then just stop with a click. I thought it strange as couldn't really imagine what I had done to a perfectly good battery but in my head the alternatives were all a lot worse so clung onto that for a while. I charged and conditioned the battery and tried starting it a few times with the same end result. I still haven't fully stripped the bike down and so still something is potentially loose etc. This morning I hooked up the multimeter and stuck my camera in front of it just to see what was happening and so I could show the symptoms without having to describe them. The first time I tried the result was the same. I saw the voltage drop when cranked as usual and tried the starter again just to see what happened and from nowhere the bike turned over and started...
with an almighty clattering soundtrack (gah)
I turned it off immediately and really don't know what to do next. I'm very nervous of making things worse! Here's the shortened video complete with horror soundtrack.
https://youtu.be/0aFR833yeLk
I could try starting the bike again and see if the noise settles down but that potentially ends with a £250 cheque coming my way from you've been framed for a video of my bike going bang and then me sobbing next to a broken bike. However I'm not sure what to check next without stripping the engine down and even then no idea what I'm looking for and that could still end with the same video :D
If it had started straight away after the accident I would probably have just let it run to see if it quietened down but the fact it didn't want to turn over or start for so long after makes me very nervous that the engine was locked somehow and something's damaged in there.
Opinions and suggestions sought...
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Kwacky » 23 May 2016, 11:25

I'll have to watch this video when I get home.

Have you checked the CCT?

I presume there's a tilt sensor on these bikes?
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby DaytonAndy » 23 May 2016, 11:33

There is a tilt sensor in the nose cone but if that was still triggered I thought it wouldn't turn over at all? Could be cam chain maybe. Will look into that...
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Kwacky » 23 May 2016, 11:40

I'm not sure about how the tilt sensor works on the 675. I presume that stopped the bike from firing after the crash but was reset. I was thinking if the sensor has a fault or was sticking that could cause the issue.

You've checked all the wires you can access including those at the battery to make sure the connections are good?

Again, without owning one (so I don't know) are there are any air or fuel sensors that could have taken a knock?

I'm thinking out aloud as to what could be the problem :)
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby rocket » 23 May 2016, 12:34

It's priming the fuel and trying to turn so it's not the tilt sensor. If it was me with that noise I would be finding the stater motor taking it out. And checking it is located and operating ok. You can test it with a 12v feed from a battery 2 wires to see if it is firing and spining freely. That's the first thing I would be checking from that sound.
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby rocket » 23 May 2016, 12:35

Also take the plugs out and see If there wet..
Last edited by rocket on 23 May 2016, 13:34, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby rocket » 23 May 2016, 12:36

Did any clouds of smoke come out when it was running
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Monty » 23 May 2016, 12:43

No idea dude sorry, this is the point I would normally get a man in!
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Cav » 23 May 2016, 13:23

On the ZX6R the tilt sensor allows the bike to turn on when started but will shut it down after about 5 seconds.

Sounds like it's blowing to be honest. Have you checked the spark plugs are all seated etc and the exhaust is connected properly?

Also, does sound like a triumph to me ;)
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby DaytonAndy » 23 May 2016, 15:17

rocket wrote:Did any clouds of smoke come out when it was running

No clouds that I saw. When I dropped it though the throttle did jam wide open with the bike sitting on its side for a second or two before the tip sensor killed it.
rocket wrote:...plugs and starter motor...

I'll check them now cheers (y)
Cav wrote:Sounds like it's blowing to be honest. Have you checked the spark plugs are all seated etc and the exhaust is connected properly?

Also, does sound like a triumph to me ;)


Haha. I was hoping for a little "that's normal sir, that all do that" (giggle) The horrible rattling noise was definitely coming from much higher up than the exhaust which is battered but seems functional.
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Cav » 23 May 2016, 15:30

To be fair, stick a mic next to any engine and you will hear a rattle. You could always stick a screwdriver on the side of the engine by the cam chain and press your ear against it - you'll definitely be able to tell then.

If you're worried it's something more serious the I guess you'd have to take the head off and have a poke around at the chain etc
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Cav » 23 May 2016, 15:31

Just a thought, was that the first time you tried starting it since you came off? Sometimes bikes are tricky to get started once they've been down because dirt etc could have gotten into the engine potentially
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Blade » 23 May 2016, 15:35

I'll be completely honest Andy I don't hear the huge clatter you mention (blush) which is either good news or I'm deaf. Either of which are possible and likely :?

I would check the starter motor as it's quick and easy but it's starting so I don't personally think it's that. Maybe the bendix isn't dis engaging but unlikely unless it took a direct impact.

Definitely worth checking the CCT as may have clicked on when over rev'd and then sudden stop. Again quick and easy job and will put your mind at rest.

Nothing to do with any noise but maybe check air filter and oil level if the bike ran on its side for a bit as easy to do and good precaution.

All though I can't here the clatter, thinking out loud could it be simply some kitty litter / gravel in the air box ? Rattling around.

Apart from that I would just try it again and let it run on. Not a lot of other options other than a full strip down which would be costly and unlikely to reveal anything.
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Deegee » 23 May 2016, 22:14

Andy, first thing is to check the acid level in your battery, I've had my 675 over on its side and it allowed a large amount of the acid to empty out of the overflow tube - without all the acid the battery will give a fraction of its proper performance and could well be responsible for the hesitant turning over in the video.

Second thing is to check the exup valve if it's still fitted - if it's jammed, stuck or the battery hasn't got enough juice for it to actuate properly when the ignition is turned on it could be partially blocking the exhaust and creating noise.

Third, check the plugs as mentioned, it may have let oil up above the piston when it was on its side, alternatively oil may have gotten into the airbox via the breather. You may have a problem with the starter, but it's unlikely, the starter on the 675 is a straight drive into a sprag clutch that mounted in a gear between the crank and the oil pump (iirc), so there's no bendix or starter ring to catch or wear.

Lastly, I'd check in the airbox for stones etc and the pulse timing cover for denting etc that will upset the timing and change the engine note.

Not much, but Hth. DG.
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby StMarks » 23 May 2016, 22:36

Sorry for the late input, I've only just read this Andy.
Could it be that the bolts retaining your new CPS you fitted has become loose.? - The CPS touching the rotor would stop the ignition signal, stopping the engine.
If it was then restarted, that moving sensor coil may be rattling against the moving rotor creating that sort of noise.?
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Blade » 24 May 2016, 01:31

Maybe of some help Andy to follow a structured approach (lol)

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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Blade » 24 May 2016, 07:13

If all the good technical advice doesn't help Andy pop down Halfords for a bottle of this stuff (lol)

Image
Last edited by Blade on 24 May 2016, 07:14, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby Blade » 24 May 2016, 07:14

All joking aside mate I hope you get it sorted (y) and you know where I am if I can help.
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby rocket » 24 May 2016, 07:26

Blade wrote:If all the good technical advice doesn't help Andy pop down Halfords for a bottle of this stuff (lol)

Image


Brake cleaner works just as goo just watch out for the back fire (devil) (devil)
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Re: What the duck have I done to my bike?

Postby StMarks » 24 May 2016, 08:33

Ok having read some of the suggestions above, & watching your video a few times again, I'm going to make another suggestion.
Not a nice one.. :(
Could it be that hot thin engine oil leaked past the piston whilst it was on it's side.?
Could it then be that the engine was tried again that oil would hydraulically lock that cylinder, making it virtually impossible for the starter to turn the engine over.?
Eventually something would have to give, perhaps a valve.?
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